Has my Nevada been wrongly wired?

Hi, I recently purchased a 2005 Nevada 750 ie classic and having fixed a number of problems present when I bought it I went off on a trip of some 1100 miles. During that time I had an intermittent starting problem that I finally tracked down to the grease retention plate coming loose in the starter motor and shorting on the armature. Having fixed that it again failed to start and I tracked that down to the starter relay. I was able to swap the two slim relays and the starter then worked. This is where it gets puzzling. I ordered all three relays from Fowlers and they duly arrived next day with one of them labelled ‘starter relay’. However, it is not the same relay that is wired in for the starter on my Nevada.

Under the seat are three relays, two for the fuel injection and one for the starter. The starter relay from Fowlers is the cube shaped relay and the two slim micro relays should therefore be for the injectors. My bike is wired with one of the slim relays for the starter, one slim relay and the cube shaped relay for the injectors. As the sockets are different for the two types of relay I can only assume that it was wired like this from new (who would change something like this?). The two slim relays are marked 12V 30A and the starter relay has no amp rating marked. As the starter is rated at 1.2kW with a 12V supply it would draw 100A. This is clearly greater than the slim relay is designed for and I guess is why it stopped working. The bike has done 18,000 miles from new.

So my question is, have the relays been wrongly wired? And if so, what is the correct orientation for the wires to each of the relays? And finally, for now, are the slim sockets available from anywhere?

there is a know problem with voltage drop in the stater circuit
I put up with it for years, before I used Brians drawing on this forum and put a new feed from the battery via a fuse to the starter circuit
the starter motors are Valeo and quite a few are a bit rubbish
water ingress is a problem ( I seal the cable entries with silicon grease)
magnets coming loose on early ones
and the solenoid piston thing sticking or corroding
I am sure my starter relay is one of the tiny ones, mines a breva but everything seems the same on the nevada
there is a large box thing that looks like a relay in the centre at the rear, but it is in fact an angle switch that cuts the fuel pump if you drop the bike
all the other relays are tiny
I am going away for a few days, but I am sure some one here will help out
I am in the Gloucester area if thats any use to you, I can have a look see as I am a sparkie by trade and have a few spare parts here
regards Rapheal

I meant to say
dont worry about the starter current
the solenoid has a massive set of contacts that supply the current from the live feed to the solenoid
when you press the button, the coil pulls the arm in, it then engages the contacts to energise the starter, and the additonal current from the solenoid pulls it forward to engage the gears
its well weird, but its French

Hi Rapheal, thanks for your comments. I had seen Brian’s post on the wiring mod but as the wires are different colours on my Nevada I have not yet looked at it further. The magnets are fine and there is no internal water corrosion, the solenoid moves freely and I had clocked the tilt sensor when looking for the intermittent starting problem.

I guess your comment about the starter current not being a problem may be borne out by the fact that it has gone 18,000 miles on the current relay configuration, but then again, as I have only had it for the last1200 miles I don’t know how many relays have gone west before this.

I’m not an electrical engineer but it seems to me that components are built to certain operating specifications and whilst a lower spec relay may work for a period of time it is likely to be subject to earlier failure than a ‘correctly’ specced component. As there is a discrepancy between the new starter relay that came from Fowlers and the existing relay usage in my bike I am keen (being something of pedant :roll: ) to resolve this in my mind.

I rode through Cheltenham a couple of weeks back on my way home from Ireland to Worthing, it would have been good to meet up. Maybe next time  Regards, Vic

Just tested all the relays and get continuity on all of them so now going to apply Brian’s fix. (Having read further I now get that 30amps is OK for the starter relay. Still don’t get why they used two micro relays and one mini relay but hey-ho!)

Well, that hasn’t worked :frowning: and that’s enough for tonight.

Today I tested the starter by feeding the spade terminal on the solenoid directly from the battery and nothing so I took the starter out and tested it on the bench still nothing so I guess the solenoid has failed? In checking the brushes I found loose bits of plastic and when holding back the springs to insert the brushes the holding plate disintegrated so it’s not going well. Should I repair it or replace the whole unit?

I am assuming this is a Valeo starter. Cheapo replacements come up for sale on e\Bay, chinese copies I expect
These are good for Valeo parts & the price should be low enough to avoid import duties???
http://www.euromotoelectrics.com/searchresults.asp?Search=valeo&Submit=Submit

That’ll be it then. The solenoid grounds thru the starter motor so no brushes, solenoid no workee either.

I think I got my last repair kit from Motomecca
it came with brushes, brush holders, and few other bits
easy enough to install
its French what do you expect !!!

To eat stinky chees before running up a white flag.
Well that’s my quota of xenophobia for the week.

And here’s mine:







.

I am giving my age away, but I remember those lads cycling up from the coast
Onion Johnnies I think they were called

The white flag is duly raised… brushes and solenoid coming from Ireland and a cheap new starter from Germany (where it’s made I have no idea yet). This way I should have a spare and all for a third of the price of a new Valeo. Hopefully cheap will end up being cheerful. :laughing:

Cheap and cheerful arrived from Germany this morning, two days for a 2-3 week delivery :sunglasses: . Fitted and working perfectly, after removing the bypass wiring I did earlier! (Clearly I selected the wrong wire when trying Brian’s fix, hmmm :confused: ). The motor came from Woospa GmbH (World of spare parts) and I have to say, the casting for the gear housing looks far smoother than the Valeo. So I could finally fill up after my recent 1130 mile trip and find that I’m averaging 63mpg which don’t seem bad. In one stint, ridden gently but keeping up to the speed limit on A and B roads, I was getting over 80mpg. Happy days and thanks for all the help. :smiley:

Good to here, enjoy it.